nixd2001
Sep 14, 07:48 PM
Originally posted by onemoof
Someone asked the difference between RISC and CISC.
First thing, there isn't that distinction anymore. RISC originally meant that the processor had fixed width instructions (so it wouldn't have to waste time asking the software how big the next instruction will be). CISC mean that the processor had variable width instructions (meaning time would have to be taken to figure out how long the next instruction is before fetching it.) However, Intel has addressed this problem by making it possible for the processor to switch to a fixed-width mode for special processor intensive purposes. The PowerPC is stuck with fixed-width and has no ability to enjoy the flexibility of variable-width instructions for non-processor-intensive tasks. This means that CISC is now better than RISC. (Using the terms to loosely define Pentium as CISC and PowerPC as RISC.)
Originally it was Reduced versus Complex instruction set computer. Making simpler processors go faster is generally easier than making complex processors go faster as there is less internal state/logic to synchronise and keep track of. For any given fabrication technology, this still generally holds true. Intel managed to sidestep this principle by investing massive sums in their fab plants, effectively meaning that the fab processes being compared weren't the same.
The opposite end of the spectrum from RISC is arguably the VAX line. With this instruction set, massive complexities arose from the fact that a single instruction took so long and did so much. It was possible for timers, interrupts and "page faults" to occur midway during an instruction. This required saving a lot of internal state so that it could later be restored. There were examples of performing a given operation with a single instruction or a sequence of instructions that performed the same effect, but where the sequence achieved the join quicker because the internal implementation within the processor was able to get on with the job quicker because it was actually a simpler task being asked of it.
The idea of fixed sized instructions isn't directly coupled to the original notion of RISC, although it is only one step behind. One of the basic ideas with the original RISC processors was that an instruction should only take a single cycle to complete. So a 100MHz CPU might actually achieve 100M instructions per second. (This was often not achieved due to memory latencies, but this isn't the "fault" of the processor core). In this context, having a variable length instruction means that it is easy for the instruction decoding (especially if it requires more than one "word") to require for effort than any other aspect of executing an instruction.
There are situations where a variable width instruction might have advantages, but the argument goes that breaking the overall task down into equal sized instructions means that fetching (including caching, branch predicting, ec) and decoding these instructions becomes simpler, permitting optimisations and speed gains to be made elsewhere in the processor design.
Intel blur RISC and CISC into gray by effectively executing RISC instructions internally, even if they support the apparent decoding of CISC insructions. They only do this for legacy reasons.
Apple will never switch to IA32 (Pentium) because 32 bit processors are a dead-end and maybe have a couple years left. The reason is because they can only have a maximum of 4 GB of RAM [ (2^32)/(1 Billion) = 4.29 GB ]. This limit is very close to being reached in current desktop computers. Apple MAY at some point decide to jump to IA64 in my opinion, and I think they should. Obviously the Intel family of processors is unbeatable unless they have some sort of catastrophe happen to them. If Apple jumped on they'd be back on track. Unfortunately I don't believe IA64 is yet cheap enough for desktops.
I think this "unbeatable" assertion requires some qualification. It may be that Intel will achieve the best price/performance ratio within a suitable range of qualifications, but this is different from always achieving best p/p ratio whatever. Indeed, IA64 versus Power4 is going to be an interesting battle because Intel has bet on ILP (instruction level parallelism) whereas IBM has bet on data bandwidth. Ultimately (and today!), I think IBM's bet has more going for it. But that's if you want ultimate performance. The PC space is often characterised by people apparenntly wanting ultimate performance but actually always massively qualifiying it with severe price restrictions (such as less than 5 digits to the price).
Someone asked the difference between RISC and CISC.
First thing, there isn't that distinction anymore. RISC originally meant that the processor had fixed width instructions (so it wouldn't have to waste time asking the software how big the next instruction will be). CISC mean that the processor had variable width instructions (meaning time would have to be taken to figure out how long the next instruction is before fetching it.) However, Intel has addressed this problem by making it possible for the processor to switch to a fixed-width mode for special processor intensive purposes. The PowerPC is stuck with fixed-width and has no ability to enjoy the flexibility of variable-width instructions for non-processor-intensive tasks. This means that CISC is now better than RISC. (Using the terms to loosely define Pentium as CISC and PowerPC as RISC.)
Originally it was Reduced versus Complex instruction set computer. Making simpler processors go faster is generally easier than making complex processors go faster as there is less internal state/logic to synchronise and keep track of. For any given fabrication technology, this still generally holds true. Intel managed to sidestep this principle by investing massive sums in their fab plants, effectively meaning that the fab processes being compared weren't the same.
The opposite end of the spectrum from RISC is arguably the VAX line. With this instruction set, massive complexities arose from the fact that a single instruction took so long and did so much. It was possible for timers, interrupts and "page faults" to occur midway during an instruction. This required saving a lot of internal state so that it could later be restored. There were examples of performing a given operation with a single instruction or a sequence of instructions that performed the same effect, but where the sequence achieved the join quicker because the internal implementation within the processor was able to get on with the job quicker because it was actually a simpler task being asked of it.
The idea of fixed sized instructions isn't directly coupled to the original notion of RISC, although it is only one step behind. One of the basic ideas with the original RISC processors was that an instruction should only take a single cycle to complete. So a 100MHz CPU might actually achieve 100M instructions per second. (This was often not achieved due to memory latencies, but this isn't the "fault" of the processor core). In this context, having a variable length instruction means that it is easy for the instruction decoding (especially if it requires more than one "word") to require for effort than any other aspect of executing an instruction.
There are situations where a variable width instruction might have advantages, but the argument goes that breaking the overall task down into equal sized instructions means that fetching (including caching, branch predicting, ec) and decoding these instructions becomes simpler, permitting optimisations and speed gains to be made elsewhere in the processor design.
Intel blur RISC and CISC into gray by effectively executing RISC instructions internally, even if they support the apparent decoding of CISC insructions. They only do this for legacy reasons.
Apple will never switch to IA32 (Pentium) because 32 bit processors are a dead-end and maybe have a couple years left. The reason is because they can only have a maximum of 4 GB of RAM [ (2^32)/(1 Billion) = 4.29 GB ]. This limit is very close to being reached in current desktop computers. Apple MAY at some point decide to jump to IA64 in my opinion, and I think they should. Obviously the Intel family of processors is unbeatable unless they have some sort of catastrophe happen to them. If Apple jumped on they'd be back on track. Unfortunately I don't believe IA64 is yet cheap enough for desktops.
I think this "unbeatable" assertion requires some qualification. It may be that Intel will achieve the best price/performance ratio within a suitable range of qualifications, but this is different from always achieving best p/p ratio whatever. Indeed, IA64 versus Power4 is going to be an interesting battle because Intel has bet on ILP (instruction level parallelism) whereas IBM has bet on data bandwidth. Ultimately (and today!), I think IBM's bet has more going for it. But that's if you want ultimate performance. The PC space is often characterised by people apparenntly wanting ultimate performance but actually always massively qualifiying it with severe price restrictions (such as less than 5 digits to the price).
Narrie
Mar 28, 08:16 AM
Looking forward!
Adidas Addict
Apr 19, 10:25 AM
I totally agree. Why anyone would hold out for that color and why Apple spent so much time trying to get that white paint to work properly is beyond me.
It won't be beyond you once you see how fast it sells. ;)
It won't be beyond you once you see how fast it sells. ;)
carlgo
Mar 27, 10:35 AM
"If I moved just this far over I bet I could get reception...."
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kainjow
Sep 25, 11:41 AM
I wonder why the iTunes store video downloads were upgraded in size recently but no current iPod can take advantage of this new format. I still speculate that we'll see a new larger format Video iPod that can do double duty for us photographers.
All 5G iPods with upgraded firmware to 1.2 can play the iTS movies just fine.
All 5G iPods with upgraded firmware to 1.2 can play the iTS movies just fine.
twoodcc
Apr 16, 10:51 AM
I'd like to help. I think my PS3 can do Folding.
yes, the ps3 can fold. just remember to join team 3446! and your ps3 should get around 900-1000 ppd (points per day)
i'll be getting more involved with this as soon as my electricity supplier has finally changed, should be a couple of weeks, my current love overcharging me for leaving things running 24/7.
i'll also try and sort out the software for my ps3, i barely use that so it'd prolly out do my computer looool
Powermac G5 dual 2.0Ghz teh Mac Pro is coming later this year hopefully :D
sounds good :) we need all the help we can get. and that mac pro will do nicely!
Everyone has lost interest in doing this kind of thing I guess. Maybe when they removed the screensaver, for good reasons, it wasn't as interesting for some people. Upgrading to new clients can be a hassle.
I think if the stats were more interesting, I would like to have a better way to see how I'm doing against people on other teams.
Kakaostats may go by the wayside, he doesn't have individual stats anymore and the rest of his stats are questionable because of some bug.:(
do you ever use these stats? (http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/team_summary.php?s=&t=3446)
you can see other individuals also. and see how you rank against them
Every little bit helps. But what we really need is people with 8 cores plus (virtual, desktop machine) running bigadv, at least until faster GPU and/or a GPU client for mac.
yeah we do. of course GPU folding in windows helps also. but not as good as bigadv. apple needs to release the new mac pros soon!
Glad to hear from other users on the forum :)
We have lost more active users since I started this thread :( Come on every one, every bit helps. Hell if we had 1000 users folding 100 points a day that would go a long way, and for those who don't fold 100 points is not that hard for a modern computer :)
yes we do need more users. 1,000 users @ 100 ppd is 100,000 ppd. whiterabbit is doing almost that by himself!
yes, the ps3 can fold. just remember to join team 3446! and your ps3 should get around 900-1000 ppd (points per day)
i'll be getting more involved with this as soon as my electricity supplier has finally changed, should be a couple of weeks, my current love overcharging me for leaving things running 24/7.
i'll also try and sort out the software for my ps3, i barely use that so it'd prolly out do my computer looool
Powermac G5 dual 2.0Ghz teh Mac Pro is coming later this year hopefully :D
sounds good :) we need all the help we can get. and that mac pro will do nicely!
Everyone has lost interest in doing this kind of thing I guess. Maybe when they removed the screensaver, for good reasons, it wasn't as interesting for some people. Upgrading to new clients can be a hassle.
I think if the stats were more interesting, I would like to have a better way to see how I'm doing against people on other teams.
Kakaostats may go by the wayside, he doesn't have individual stats anymore and the rest of his stats are questionable because of some bug.:(
do you ever use these stats? (http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/team_summary.php?s=&t=3446)
you can see other individuals also. and see how you rank against them
Every little bit helps. But what we really need is people with 8 cores plus (virtual, desktop machine) running bigadv, at least until faster GPU and/or a GPU client for mac.
yeah we do. of course GPU folding in windows helps also. but not as good as bigadv. apple needs to release the new mac pros soon!
Glad to hear from other users on the forum :)
We have lost more active users since I started this thread :( Come on every one, every bit helps. Hell if we had 1000 users folding 100 points a day that would go a long way, and for those who don't fold 100 points is not that hard for a modern computer :)
yes we do need more users. 1,000 users @ 100 ppd is 100,000 ppd. whiterabbit is doing almost that by himself!
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dernhelm
Nov 2, 02:04 PM
Good points. Apple are doing great, but the lack of dedicated graphics in consumer-priced Macs aimed at switchers & students, many of whom will already own PC games, is an oversight. Otherwise, Apple's marketshare could be far higher.
Also, as 0010101 posted earlier, there'll be huge numbers of people holding back from buying PCs due to Vista's delay. Let's see if Apple can repeat their current success next year, when millions of PCs pre-loaded with Vista hit the shops. IMO, without significant upgrades to consumer-priced Macs, Apple's marketshare is unlikely to continue growing beyond the busy pre-Xmas retail season.
In respect to the dedicated graphics card, I totally agree with you here. I keep saying it, but a dedicated gaming machine made in the Apple style would absolutely vault them 5% in share overnight. Maybe more.
However in my experience, fewer people are waiting on Vista for a new machine than you may think. I'm really surprised at how little buzz Vista is getting. I've got several friends with HIGH END hardware running Vista beta now, and the all think it works great except for Aero, which to a person they have all turned off. Every single one of them complains about the speed, but say it is very solid crash-wise, especially for a beta. But when I press them if they will actually buy Vista the day it comes out, all but one said no. The main reason is that there is just nothing all that compelling there. And what with significant evidence (http://media.grc.com/sn/SN-051.mp3) that they have completely re-written their networking stack, I think I'll be with them on the sidelines waiting for a while until they work the bugs out.
So at least in my limited experience, people who need new hardware are buying it now - and not really waiting for Vista, which may be 9-12 months off for them anyway. What this means to me is that Apple's marketshare increases can be written off as an anomaly all that easily.
Also, as 0010101 posted earlier, there'll be huge numbers of people holding back from buying PCs due to Vista's delay. Let's see if Apple can repeat their current success next year, when millions of PCs pre-loaded with Vista hit the shops. IMO, without significant upgrades to consumer-priced Macs, Apple's marketshare is unlikely to continue growing beyond the busy pre-Xmas retail season.
In respect to the dedicated graphics card, I totally agree with you here. I keep saying it, but a dedicated gaming machine made in the Apple style would absolutely vault them 5% in share overnight. Maybe more.
However in my experience, fewer people are waiting on Vista for a new machine than you may think. I'm really surprised at how little buzz Vista is getting. I've got several friends with HIGH END hardware running Vista beta now, and the all think it works great except for Aero, which to a person they have all turned off. Every single one of them complains about the speed, but say it is very solid crash-wise, especially for a beta. But when I press them if they will actually buy Vista the day it comes out, all but one said no. The main reason is that there is just nothing all that compelling there. And what with significant evidence (http://media.grc.com/sn/SN-051.mp3) that they have completely re-written their networking stack, I think I'll be with them on the sidelines waiting for a while until they work the bugs out.
So at least in my limited experience, people who need new hardware are buying it now - and not really waiting for Vista, which may be 9-12 months off for them anyway. What this means to me is that Apple's marketshare increases can be written off as an anomaly all that easily.
firestarter
Apr 5, 05:53 PM
No, it doesn't. The line-in port does not supply power for a microphone.
Which line in port? Are you talking about the (now removed) line-in on the 30 pin connector (not on iPhone 4) or are you talking about the second ring on the TRRS headphone/mic connector?
Which line in port? Are you talking about the (now removed) line-in on the 30 pin connector (not on iPhone 4) or are you talking about the second ring on the TRRS headphone/mic connector?
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Eraserhead
Sep 27, 11:24 AM
I checked the update pace for Mac OS X 10.4.
29/04/2005: 10.4.0
17/05/2005: 10.4.1 (+ 18 days)
12/07/2005: 10.4.2 (+ 56 days)
31/10/2005: 10.4.3 (+ 111 days)
11/01/2006: 10.4.4 (+ 72 days)
14/02/2006: 10.4.5 (+ 34 days)
03/04/2006: 10.4.6 (+ 48 days)
27/06/2006: 10.4.7 (+ 85 days)
27/09/2006 (today) + 92 days
Soon we'll have 10.4.8, and then probably around 3 months later 10.4.9 (January?). I doubt Apple will release 10.4.10, they could but I don't think they ever did it with another OS.
I thought first that it could mean that Leopard would be early, but I don't think so (spring 2007 is March 21 - June 21).
That's better, not that it really matters... ;)
29/04/2005: 10.4.0
17/05/2005: 10.4.1 (+ 18 days)
12/07/2005: 10.4.2 (+ 56 days)
31/10/2005: 10.4.3 (+ 111 days)
11/01/2006: 10.4.4 (+ 72 days)
14/02/2006: 10.4.5 (+ 34 days)
03/04/2006: 10.4.6 (+ 48 days)
27/06/2006: 10.4.7 (+ 85 days)
27/09/2006 (today) + 92 days
Soon we'll have 10.4.8, and then probably around 3 months later 10.4.9 (January?). I doubt Apple will release 10.4.10, they could but I don't think they ever did it with another OS.
I thought first that it could mean that Leopard would be early, but I don't think so (spring 2007 is March 21 - June 21).
That's better, not that it really matters... ;)
Bernard SG
May 4, 04:01 AM
some tasks in OS X, such as networking, is insanely hard than the simplicity of the Network and Sharing Centre provided in Windows.
What???
It probably depends on the specifics of the network you want to build, but overall, I always found it ridiculously easy to build a Mac OS network than a Windows one.
You may want to provide specific examples on how networking in OS X is 'insanely hard' as compared to Windows.
What???
It probably depends on the specifics of the network you want to build, but overall, I always found it ridiculously easy to build a Mac OS network than a Windows one.
You may want to provide specific examples on how networking in OS X is 'insanely hard' as compared to Windows.
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bcaslis
Apr 21, 12:10 PM
You right. But that's a very common theory here on these threads. I use that analogy to suggest how ridiculous that would be if Apple really did remove it to 'differentiate' the product lines.
I've heard that they removed it because they couldn't fit it into the current MBA (which is thinner than before). Makes sense to me. Personally, I've had numerous MBPs and the original MBA. I've found I don't really miss it.
I've heard that they removed it because they couldn't fit it into the current MBA (which is thinner than before). Makes sense to me. Personally, I've had numerous MBPs and the original MBA. I've found I don't really miss it.
SteveRichardson
Aug 14, 02:43 PM
I disagree totally. People buy superiority. Thats what a good portion of the population wants. Thats why peop;le buy designer clothes. Thats why people buy fancy cars. Thats why people buy expensive jewelery. Thats why people stay at 5 star hotels. People want to feel like they are better than everyone else or they've made better choices.
Not everyone of course. But there are alot.
Porsche never created a commercial with a dude representing a Porsche telling a dude representing a Hyundai that all Porsche vehicles are superior to Hyundai vehicles.
Yves Saint Laurent never created a commercial with a dude representing Yves Saint Laurent telling a dude representing clothing sold at Wal Mart that all Yves Saint Laurent clothing is superior to Wal Mart's clothing.
The Four Seasons Hotel never created a commercial with a dude representing The Four Seasons telling a dude representing Days Inn that The Four Seasons Hotel is superior to the Days Inn.
All of these "top-of-the-line" companies create advertisements showing their products in the best light possible, without resorting to childish arguments of who's better.
Not everyone of course. But there are alot.
Porsche never created a commercial with a dude representing a Porsche telling a dude representing a Hyundai that all Porsche vehicles are superior to Hyundai vehicles.
Yves Saint Laurent never created a commercial with a dude representing Yves Saint Laurent telling a dude representing clothing sold at Wal Mart that all Yves Saint Laurent clothing is superior to Wal Mart's clothing.
The Four Seasons Hotel never created a commercial with a dude representing The Four Seasons telling a dude representing Days Inn that The Four Seasons Hotel is superior to the Days Inn.
All of these "top-of-the-line" companies create advertisements showing their products in the best light possible, without resorting to childish arguments of who's better.
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jdczar
Mar 10, 09:11 AM
I will be at the Fort Worth store too im not expecting a crowd
freewebsites
Nov 11, 02:30 PM
Iphone is still the best!
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Compufix
Sep 20, 06:04 PM
That's really interesting! You just held "c" at boot to load up the XP CD?
I'm guessing you still needed to use a "slipstreamed" XP SP2 CD with the SATA drivers installed so it doesn't run in dog slow PIO mode
Where the hell did you find chipset drivers, graphics card drivers, sound card drivers etc? :confused:
You still need a driver CD from Apple for all that...you can get that from someone that installed Bootcamp....
Supposedly the new EFI update for Mac Pro (just released) solves the PIO problem without needs to slipstream the XP CD. I won't know until tomorrow, however I already did the slipstream install....so who knows what will happen.
short haircuts for round faces
more...
hairstyles for round faces and
hairstyles for round faces and
short haircuts for round faces
I'm guessing you still needed to use a "slipstreamed" XP SP2 CD with the SATA drivers installed so it doesn't run in dog slow PIO mode
Where the hell did you find chipset drivers, graphics card drivers, sound card drivers etc? :confused:
You still need a driver CD from Apple for all that...you can get that from someone that installed Bootcamp....
Supposedly the new EFI update for Mac Pro (just released) solves the PIO problem without needs to slipstream the XP CD. I won't know until tomorrow, however I already did the slipstream install....so who knows what will happen.
orangephoto
Sep 20, 10:13 AM
ok the first one is all i needed
the smc said it was already up
now if they would only fix the airport issues...
i hate internet sharing with my powerbook
the smc said it was already up
now if they would only fix the airport issues...
i hate internet sharing with my powerbook
more...
SevenInchScrew
Jun 17, 10:47 PM
So the only model they're going to sell is the Elite Slim one once the supplies on the current Arcade and Pro are out?
I give up. I'm not the droid you're looking for. Move along. Move along.
I give up. I'm not the droid you're looking for. Move along. Move along.
ImAlwaysRight
Sep 25, 11:21 AM
It says "MacBook" updates at this event. I hope that wasn't a typo! :eek: :D
It is not a typo, but look at the full statement: There have been rumors of Aperture updates and possibly MacBook updates at this event.
You have neglected two key words, "rumors" and "possibly." Those two words in combination like that shouldn't get your hopes up that much for a MacBook update. :(
It is not a typo, but look at the full statement: There have been rumors of Aperture updates and possibly MacBook updates at this event.
You have neglected two key words, "rumors" and "possibly." Those two words in combination like that shouldn't get your hopes up that much for a MacBook update. :(
blueroom
Apr 29, 12:46 PM
Take it back to where you bought it.
AhmedFaisal
Apr 8, 05:45 PM
Interestingly, Paul Ryan's proposal decidedly does NOT include any legislation forcing private payers to insure elderly people at reasonable rates. Talk about death panels.......... what most of these morons in the Tea Party don't realize is that the net effect of the Ryan plan is that the vast majority of elderly people will simply NOT have insurance because either they can't afford it or no private payer will take them, which translates into no access to healthcare especially if they have their way with medicaid. Congratulations USA, you are about the reduce your average life expectancy to that of Russia, but hey, it will fix social security because there will be no one left alive to receive retirement benefits.............
The argument is using Tax Dollars to pay for the abortions as it is forbidden by Federal Law for Planned Parenthood to use the funding in that way...of course they have found ways around it, which is the cause for concern..Me personally, I am on the fence on the entire issue as I am not a woman. That stated, I don't believe abortions should be used as a birth control device either....
If the laughably few moronic women who indeed believe this to be a form of birth control do not procreate because of it, I am happy for the genepool. No harm done I say. You people do realize that every abortion has a significant risk of causing infertility and other complications, right? And these risk compound with every procedure....... I'd like to actually meet a woman that thinks this is a good way of contraception... just saying...........
The argument is using Tax Dollars to pay for the abortions as it is forbidden by Federal Law for Planned Parenthood to use the funding in that way...of course they have found ways around it, which is the cause for concern..Me personally, I am on the fence on the entire issue as I am not a woman. That stated, I don't believe abortions should be used as a birth control device either....
If the laughably few moronic women who indeed believe this to be a form of birth control do not procreate because of it, I am happy for the genepool. No harm done I say. You people do realize that every abortion has a significant risk of causing infertility and other complications, right? And these risk compound with every procedure....... I'd like to actually meet a woman that thinks this is a good way of contraception... just saying...........
Knowimagination
Mar 7, 08:46 PM
:apple:
Why wait outdoors (Knox) when you can wait indoors (Northpark)?
It is supposed to be a high of 70 and sunny all day friday, why wouldn't someone want to spend some time outside with that nice of weather.
Why wait outdoors (Knox) when you can wait indoors (Northpark)?
It is supposed to be a high of 70 and sunny all day friday, why wouldn't someone want to spend some time outside with that nice of weather.
IntelliUser
May 3, 10:37 AM
Canada seems to be following Europe, where conservatives gained power in the recent years, even in traditionally liberal countries.
840quadra
Sep 27, 11:58 AM
Oh noes! The dreaded off-topic discussion on numbering schemes that pops up after each os update. ;)
indeed the trend continues!
None the less, I am excited for a new build!
indeed the trend continues!
None the less, I am excited for a new build!
HiRez
Nov 11, 10:54 AM
That's what you get for voting the Democrats in!See? Look, they actually accomplished something in only four days!
